22 “You shall surely tithe all the produce from what you sow, which comes out of the field every year. 23 “You shall eat in the presence of the LORD your God, at the place where He chooses to establish His name, the tithe of your grain, your new wine, your oil, and the firstborn of your herd and your flock, so that you may learn to fear the LORD your God always. 24 “If the distance is so great for you that you are not able to bring the tithe, since the place where the LORD your God chooses to set His name is too far away from you when the LORD your God blesses you, 25 then you shall exchange it for money, and bind the money in your hand and go to the place which the LORD your God chooses. 26 “You may spend the money for whatever your heart desires: for oxen, or sheep, or wine, or strong drink, or whatever your heart desires; and there you shall eat in the presence of the LORD your God and rejoice, you and your household.

The meaning there is not hidden or ambiguous. To confirm, look at a lexicon and you can see the word for “strong drink” is “shekar”, which is defined as “an intoxicant, i.e. intensely alcoholic liquor — strong drink, + drunkard, strong wine.”

If the act of drinking is a sin, why would God make a commandment to sin when tithing?

Then in Matthew 11:19 Jesus indicates that people have seen him eating and drinking as they say “Behold a man gluttonous and a winebibber a friend of publicans and sinners”. What he says about John the Baptist is true – he did not eat bread with yeast or wine or other fermented drink – why would he speak an untruth about himself? It makes no sense.

We need to open ourselves up to God and ask that he open our eyes and heart to his teaching. We need to throw our preconceived ideas and let the truth in. If we twist the truth to fit our beliefs, we are altering God’s word – which IS A SIN! And then if we teach that to others, it is even worse! It would be better if that person were not born!

As Mary said: “I am the Lord’s servant. May it be to me as you have said.” – when God speaks, we should say this same thing and be obedient to the teaching (remembering that obedience doesn’t question – it follows – Mary was obedient and God blessed her – Zechariah questioned him and was made mute).

With all respect due you, your arguments fall as flat as an open beer that has been sitting around all day.

Bob has not only correct scripture interpretation on his side, but history as well.

Last, your statement,

The remnant, the Godly, the smaller number goes my way.

is quite offensive. The obvious import of your sentence is that we who enjoy God’s good gift of drink are not part of God’s people and surely are not godly.

You are perhaps right about the “smaller number” going your way, though.

I call on Christians everywhere to cease from the addictive drug of alcohol in all its forms!

God does not provide us with an inerrant dictionary of the ancient languages. (p. 9)

God has never provided that translators should be inerrant. (p. 17)

What follows is as far as I know an innovation. (p. 35)

We must not rely even on generally accepted English dictionaries in determining what a word may or may not mean when used by educated speakers of the English language. Dictionary writers are bound up in their prejudices, a common human failing. (p. 139).

Then he discusses Reynold’s interpretation which Brandenburg quoted above. The translation of “lees” in Isaiah 25.

Of his own view he writes, “The improbable must be the correct answer. That is, the hypothesis that shemarim in Isaiah 25:6 does not mean lees at all. It is true that the lexicographers do not recognize any other meaning for shemer than dregs, lees or sediment, but we must face the improbable answer that they are incorrect in this particular verse” (p. 60).

To affirm his view, that “wine on the lees” does not actually mean “wine aged to full maturity,” he resorts to criticizing the New International Version (p. 62) and disagreeing with the 1985 Jewish translation of the Hebrew Old Testament (Tanakh), which he lauded as, “Accomplished by Jewish scholars judged by competent Jewish people to be extremely well qualified to bring the Hebrew Scriptures to the large and generally well-eduated world of English speaking adherents of Judaism” (p. 63).

Regarding his interpretation of other references to lees (or “dregs,” as in Psalms 75:8), he admits, “I know of no previous writer who has suggested it” (p. 75). Elsewhere he confesses, “It is true that this translation may appear somewhat innovative” (p. 78).

So, there you have it. Rather than accept the clear Scriptural commendation of clearly alcoholic wine in Isaiah 25, people like Reynolds will come up with innovative translations of the Hebrew to try to circumvent the clear meaning.

I suppose I could add that in Rom. 14 the debate centered on the drinking of wine. There’s little to suggest that some had scruples with unfermented grape juice, so its strongly probable that fermented wine was in view. Paul makes it a non-issue, because the Kingdom of God is bigger than questions of eating and drinking. He tells believers to accept one another despite their positions in this matter.

In Colossians we also find pertinent instruction that touches on this debate:

If with Christ you died to the elemental spirits of the world, why, as if you were still alive in the world, do you submit to regulations— “Do not handle, Do not taste, Do not touch” (referring to things that all perish as they are used)—according to human precepts and teachings? These have indeed an appearance of wisdom in promoting self-made religion and asceticism and severity to the body, but they are of no value in stopping the indulgence of the flesh. (Col. 3:20-23)

Of course, this should not be mainly about liberty. We need to avoid sin and drunkenness is sin. For me, its about lining myself up with what Scripture teaches on this subject. Not twisting it to fit my particular traditional view. If God approves of the drink, but warns of its abuse, then who am I to disapprove of it, and stay away from any use of it?

Again, thanks for chiming in, God bless.

Bob

In the 1970’s Baptist type church I was a part of –any alcohol-any movie -most TV-and any kind of smoking was just plain outright sin.

Young believers today have moved a very long way from that position.

As I have studied these issues and looked at the Bible alone, I have come to the following conclusion:

Our bodies(as believers) are the dwelling place of the Holy Spirit and belong to the Lord. Anything we do to harm our body is sin. That would certainly include gluttony and overeating and becoming fat–which I hear very little about in most of these discussions.

It would seem to me that the Scripture teaches that Drunkenness is the issue which is sin, not drinking wine.
Paul says this in 1 Cor 6:12-13
“All things are lawful for me, but not all things are helpful. All things are lawful for me, but I will not be enslaved by anything.” ESV

My only concern is that as you young believers chose liberty over legalism you will not be enslaved to anything including your liberty, and that the Glory of God would be your only passion.